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Dara
(acolyte)
04/17/06 12:13 PM
Re: The atheist's vie.... new [re: to_dizzy]  

In reply to:

Does anyone at TW believe that cannibalism and murder are wrong?


I believe they are intrinsically wrong, in and of themselves.

Are you saying that the only good reason for believing murder is wrong because (a) God (yours) said so, or at least you believe he, she or it did. Even if your God did forbid murder, it is not the fact that God forbids it that makes it wrong. Rather it is the fact that it is wrong that makes your God forbid it (if he's a half decent God). The alternative is to suggest that your God forbids murder for no good reason. In which case, what use is God?

Slan leat,

Dara

"Irish as well, you see. Home of God himself" - Noel Gallagher on U2

to_dizzy
(electric tomato)
04/17/06 12:19 PM
Re: The atheist's vie.... new [re: Dara]  

In reply to:

I believe they are intrinsically wrong, in and of themselves.


But Kevin Underwood does not concur with your beliefs. His feelings are valid too, just as yours are. If not, why not?





to_dizzy
(electric tomato)
04/17/06 12:24 PM
Re: The atheist's vie.... new [re: to_dizzy]  

All of TW is cowering in fear now. You can't seem to articulate why your values count more than the murderers and cannibals of the world.



Pablo-Picasso
(acolyte)
04/17/06 12:29 PM
Re: The atheist's vie.... new [re: to_dizzy]  

An individuals beliefs and practices are valid as long as they do not impeach on the liberty or freedom of others. Irrespective of religion and law there is a moral code which most people live by.
You seem to be implying that it is a lack of god in this persons life which has led to him having a disregard for the mortality of others. Well, what of serial killers or even leaders of armies who justify their killing in God's name? Your argument is flawed and it is not up to us to give reason why it is wrong for this person to kill, it is up to you, as you brought the subject up, to give a water tight case of why he is right. I don't think you can though.

-----------------------------------------------------------------------
Illustrated Discography
Bassman
Helden

riley
(crash course raver)
04/17/06 12:35 PM
Re: The atheist's vie.... new [re: to_dizzy]  

Do you really want a history lesson on the ethics of religion and belief? Moral relativity can exist when a priest is about to bugger a kid.. he'll just tell himself 'god forgives' to justify his own disgusting behaviour.. and women burned alive were being 'saved' by their murderers. I've already explained why morals [and sometimes immorality; eg killing in self defence] are necessary.. we are a social species.. now perhaps you could explain to me why you completely ignored this point and persisted in attacking atheists in general? I consider persecution to be immoral.. you don't. Why is this? Because you need to justify your choice to indulge in immorality by qualifying it with 'god'.. worse than that you used the tragedy of a child murder to attack a group of people while pretending to be teaching morals. Hypocricey at it's finest. Atheists have no such luxury with morality.. something is either immoral or it is not- there is no negotiating actions with imaginary beings.

krettis
(cracked actor)
04/17/06 12:42 PM
Re: The atheist's vie.... new [re: to_dizzy]  

To_Dizzy, there are a lot of countries which keep religion and politics separated. Now, do you see a lot of activity in canibalism in those countries?
The U.S. , which has a lot of trouble keeping those two separately and in a way looks like Iran, has a cannibal.
Now with your logic that would mean that those who fear God are cannibals.

In every occasion I'm ready for a funeral.


Hannibal_Lecter
(wild eyed peoploid)
04/17/06 12:48 PM
Food glorious food [re: to_dizzy]  

Too Dizzy, you raise many valid points to which TW has no reply. Look at the number of times Krettis has replied to this thread already with his badly-phrased and ill-conceived arguments! Admit it, Krettis: you're hysterical.

It still saddens me that many an honest cannibal faces persecution from outmoded moral codes. Many so-called atheists subscribe strictly to Christian values on the purity of marriage, the evil of abortion etc., making them mere 'Closet Christians'. And many Christians, hypocritically, partake in cannibalism every time they go to mass and believe in the literal transubstantiation of the body and blood of Christ - at least certain denominations do.

To detractors I simply say that cannibalism is like a religion to *me*, and I deserve the same civil rights and freedom to practise my religion as any citizen. I pay my taxes.

Curiously, I have a sudden urge to become a missionary in Wales. Any takers?


Honestly pianocraft,sometimes I think you've never met a real junkie;the things you say about Bowie in his cocaine era, are hilarious
~Cucumber

Dara
(acolyte)
04/17/06 01:05 PM
Re: The atheist's vie.... new [re: to_dizzy]  

In reply to:

But Kevin Underwood does not concur with your beliefs. His feelings are valid too, just as yours are. If not, why not?


There is no proof here on either side. There is no evidence that any moral principle is real. However, most people would prefer to live in a society where certain moral principles are accepted and encoded as law: thou shalt not murder little girls being one of them.

Saying you believe Y because X says so doesn't prove anything, or even necessarily strengthen your case, regardless of whether X is your God, your Dad or your dog.

Slan leat,

Dara

"Irish as well, you see. Home of God himself" - Noel Gallagher on U2

krettis
(cracked actor)
04/17/06 01:19 PM
Your submission was worth a lot! [re: Hannibal_Lecter]  

In reply to:

Too Dizzy, you raise many valid points to which TW has no reply. Look at the number of times Krettis has replied to this thread already with his badly-phrased and ill-conceived arguments! Admit it, Krettis: you're hysterical.


Badly-phrased, yes. Ill-conceived, I didn't think so. It's interesting what the motives are to eat someone. But in the atheist-christian/buddhist/whateverreligion perspective you get nowhere.
And alter-ego, the poor 'I agree whatever he says'-statement really holds position... not.

And for being hysterical: am not!
*Runs circles in the room and pulling out his hair* NOT!!

In every occasion I'm ready for a funeral.


to_dizzy
(electric tomato)
04/17/06 03:43 PM
Re: The atheist's vie.... [re: Dara]  

In reply to:

There is no proof here on either side.




You guys say that no one has the right to impose their values of sexuality, God, worship upon you, but when a man like Underwood hits the news, then you start talking about what is "intrinsically wrong." What suddenly gives you that right?

What Kevin Underwood has done is intrinsically wrong, evil. He has violated the law of God. But you people do not get to pick and choose what is intrinsically wrong, according to your personal taste.




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