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   >> Interpretation
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AdamModerator
(crash course raver)
10/24/02 03:32 AM
Bowie's Gay Songs  

I've written a new song on the new album called 'Time', and I thought it was about time, and I wrote very heavily about time, and the way I felt about time - at times! - and I played it back after we recorded it and, my God, it was a gay song! And I'd no intention of writing anything at all gay. When I listened to it back I just couldn't believe it. - Bowie, Jan 1973.

What lyrics in this song, or other Bowie songs do you interpret as notably gay?

get bowie downunder

eraserhead
(cracked actor)
10/24/02 03:46 AM
Sellout new [re: Adam]  

For some reason, I think this thread will be your most popular thread in this forum, beating even the classic I'm Deranged - Kreutzberg, Berlin, 1977.



"Don't let Krusty's death get you down, boy. People die all the time, just like that. Why, you could wake up dead tomorrow. Well, good night!" Homer Simpson


AdamModerator
(crash course raver)
10/24/02 04:22 AM
my forthcoming coffee shop thread: "I'm bisexual and always have been" new [re: eraserhead]  

Although the line "demanding Billy Dolls" has been interpreted as a reference to the (then) recent death of Billy Murcia from the New York Dolls, I found several references to the term when searching at google.

It appears that "Billy Dolls" are an entire enterprise of gay and lesbian dolls. Whether this inspired (or was inspired by) Bowie's lyric, I'm not sure.

get bowie downunder

AdamModerator
(crash course raver)
10/24/02 05:13 AM
sell, sell, sell new [re: eraserhead]  

The only other gay reference I can potentially see is Bowie's repeated use of the word "he" and "boy".

In the case of the latter, I suspect he only uses it in an exclamatory sense - expressing mild astonishment, delight or disgust. Even Buddy Holly sang "when you're with me, oh boy, the world would agree that you were meant for me".

Some others:

"He swallowed his pride and puckered his lips, and showed me the leather belt round his hips....waiting for you"

"If you want it boys, get it here thing"

"when you're a boy, other boys check you out"

"John, I'm Only Dancing" is probably Bowie's most recognised gay song, but I think the suggestion is fairly slight. That is, he is "only dancing" with the woman, and thus implying that "other rights" are reserved for John.

get bowie downunder

pianocraft
(kook)
10/24/02 05:42 AM
Re: sell, sell, sell new [re: Adam]  

I feel the cabaret style of Time may be considered part of the gay culture.



eraserhead
(cracked actor)
10/24/02 05:53 AM
Re: my forthcoming coffee shop thread: "I'm bisexual and always have been" new [re: Adam]  

Well, as you know, sex sales. That's why I said you were selling out. My initial reaction when I saw this thread was, "The teenage girls will flock over this one". And, obviously, your name sells, so it's a killer combination. :) You have a blockbuster right there.

But it's good to know what sells because when you know how to get people's attention, you can start sneaking in more important information, like the "Get Bowie Downunder" campaign. That campaign would benefit a lot from a "I'm bisexual and always have been" thread. So I say go for it. :)



"Don't let Krusty's death get you down, boy. People die all the time, just like that. Why, you could wake up dead tomorrow. Well, good night!" Homer Simpson


Starlite
(kook)
10/24/02 05:54 AM
Re: sell, sell, sell new [re: pianocraft]  

Er, not to sound like a complete dumbell, but I'm afraid I don't quite get this... Are we ignoring the "obvious" gay songs like Velvet Goldmine, Sweet Head, Changes, Queen Bitch, Lady Stardust, etc, and focusing on more ambiguous lines in other songs? Or...?

Edited by Starlite on 10/24/02 05:57 AM (server time).



AdamModerator
(crash course raver)
10/24/02 06:17 AM
clarification new [re: Starlite]  

I'm not ignoring the obvious gay songs, rather I'm wanting people to nominate specific lines or aspects about songs they find gay.

For instance, I don't find anything remotely gay about one or two songs you listed, most notably Changes.

I've already listed some songs in which I find some "gay" content, but I have likely forgotten or missed a few.

get bowie downunder

CoolCanasta
(absolute beginner )
10/24/02 06:20 AM
Re: sell, sell, sell new [re: Starlite]  

erm... i would consider this line from 'The Bewlay Brothers' as a homosexual reference....
...'i was stone and he was wax so he could scream and still relax.... unbelievable'.



Starlite
(kook)
10/24/02 06:49 AM
Re: clarification new [re: Adam]  

Ah, all right, I see now. :) I suppose I'll just explain what I found so gay in the songs I listed then.

Velvet Goldmine: Now, while the references to oral sex are pretty clear ("you got amazin' head," "I had to ravish your capsule, suck you dry," "Velvet goldmine, you stroke me like the rain," "Let my sea wash your face") I suppose the person talked about *could* be a girl ("panther princess"). However, lines like "Feel the teeth in your bones, heal ya head with my own" and the references to "sucking dry" best apply to men. Besides that, considering the original title was "He's a Velvet Goldmine" I'd say not much explanation is necessary... though I want to add that I think "velvet goldmine" is quite a lovely metaphor in this case.

Sweet Head: er, much like the previous song, the title says it all... But some specific lines: "By the faggy parks and the burnt out vans," "I'm the kind of man she warned me of"...

Changes: It can be read that the "changes" referred to in the song are those of a man figuring out he's gay. (Or of a woman, mind.) Then in "Strange fascination, fascinating me, Changes are taking the pace I'm going through" the strange fascination is homosexual desire. He was a "faker" because he used to be in the closet, and lines like "They're quite aware of what they're going through" and "Don't tell them to grow up and out of it" remind me very much of how people used to react to declarations of homosexuality. Ie, that the person in question was mistaken, that it was only a phase, a delusion, they could be "fixed." Here Bowie is saying the kids are not mistaken, they know the nature of their desires, and they will not "grow out of it." References to being spit on and shame apply to the stigma of homosexuality, etc.

Queen Bitch: Well, I see several ways of viewing this one. One of the ways is that "she" who's so "swishy in her satin and tat" is a drag(? or maybe not even?) queen of whom Bowie is jealous. By "Oh God, I could do better than that" he is being snide and saying he could dress en femme better than her, and "it could've been me" is his expression of jealousy--it could have been him with the "he" of the song.

Otherwise, I *could* see it that by "it could've been me" he means he could've been the one sleeping with the queen bitch of the title (who once again might or might not be female), and "I could do better than that" is a vain attempt to reassure himself.

All right, and as for Lady Stardust, I just think that the singer's admiration for the "boy in the bright blue jeans" is more than just casual, especially with lines like "I smiled sadly for a love I could not obey" and "Oh how I sighed when they asked if I knew his name" (supposedly "Oh how I lied" in the original version?). Also, the lady boy in question is what I'd call queer, and "Boys stood upon their chairs to make their point of view" seems to me rather innuendo-ish.

I apologize if any of this was overly obvious, in the "of course, does it even need an explanation?" sort of way, but better safe than sorry. ^_^



bowiefanpeter
(acolyte)
10/24/02 07:59 AM
Re: clarification new [re: Starlite]  

Hallo Spaceboy - "do you like boys or girls, it's confusing these day"

Also one of the first things to come...(let's chose another word)...i could think of was bowie's endorsement of the NYC disco nightlife in 1974. In it's beginning days it had an unbelievably high homosexual quotient.

What about Bowie's duets with freddie mercury and Brian molko?

BFP



Coan_teen
(crash course raver)
10/24/02 08:51 AM
Oh my god, it's like SOOO freaky! new [re: eraserhead]  

Okay, okay. I'm not flocking over this one, I swear.

Seriously, I think a lot of songs have some pretty sketch interpretations when you read too much into it. It just takes a little less work to find it in Bowie's. ;p

Personally Lady Stardust came to mind. "Ooh, how I sighed when they asked if I knew his name," "I smiled sadly for a love I could not obey," and so on.

C_t

A Elbereth Gilthoniel silivren penna míriel o menel aglar elenath! Na-chaered palan-díriel o galadhremmin ennorath fanuilos, le linnathon nef aear, sí nef aearon!

SenselessThing
(wild eyed peoploid)
10/24/02 09:18 AM
Re: clarification new [re: Starlite]  

I've always listened to Queen Bitch in the drag queen way. Looking at the cover of TMWSTW, I'm sure he could do better than anyone.

And of course Suffragette City implies he's leaving a boyfriend for the woman.



---------------------------------------------------------------------

My life was saved by rock & roll.

Davidsloveslave
(wild eyed peoploid)
10/24/02 09:23 AM
Re: sell, sell, sell new [re: Adam]  

I've yet to really see a gay reference in Time, but even I can recognize 'John I'm only dancing', as a gay song, even at 7:30 A.M. I also think Suffragette City goes along the same lines (Henry leave me alone..I can't take you this time..there's only room for one, here she comes)
I've always thought that song was a bit gay. Also Width of a Circle, for the verse that you quoted. The songs DEFINATLY gay

http:// http://dbsloveslave.diaryland.com/

goodbye_spaceboy
(absolute beginner )
10/24/02 10:13 AM
Re: Bowie's Gay Songs new [re: Adam]  

i do think that moonage daydream sums up his gay era (with the gayest in capitals);

Don't fake it baby, lay the real thing on me
THE CHURCH OF MAN LOVE IS SUCH A HOLD PLACE TO BE
Make me baby, make me know you really care
Make me jump into the air

Keep your 'lectric eye on me babe
Put your ray gun to my head
Press your space face close to mine, love




goodbye_spaceboy
(absolute beginner )
10/24/02 10:19 AM
Re: Bowie's Gay Songs new [re: Adam]  

time, obvious i know:

Time - He flexes like a whore
Falls wanking to the floor
His trick is you and me, boy




Strawman
(electric tomato)
10/24/02 12:41 PM
Re: I could be king, you would be queen. new [re: Adam]  


"Heroes" could very easily be interpreted as a gay song.

There is no mention of "He" or "She" only reference to "You" and "I".



twister
(acolyte)
10/24/02 01:51 PM
I don't see that Bowie really has many "gay" songs new [re: Adam]  

I don't see anything explicitly "gay" about John, I'm Only Dancing. The most obvious interpretation would be that John is the boyfriend of Bowie's dancing partner, and that Bowie is reassuring John that even though "she turns me on" he's "only dancing". If the narrator of the song was supposed to be gay, why would this girl be turning him on so?

Indeed, the "back street love" verse suggests the chorus could be an out-right lie, and that he is indeed banging this girl, and was caught by John ("I saw you watching from the stairs / you're everyone that ever cared"). The notion that the viewer be this John fellow comes natural from the fact he's the "you" being addressed by name through-out.

I dare say if the song was written in 1983 far less would consider the song "gay".

My favourite "gay" lyrics are in Rebel Rebel, because I appreciate the ambiguity. The "rebel" is never allocated a gender, and the song's written so intelligently to show someone rebelling against their accepted gender norms in a way that works equally either way. "You've torn your dress" being equally applicable to the boy that wears a dress, or a girl that would intentionally hack away at it. "Your face is a mess" referring to the boy that wears make-up, or the girl that would rather smudge hers terribly than fit the accepted norm (or perhaps be brave enough to go without entirely).

I could be a genius if I just put my mind to it.

SenselessThing
(wild eyed peoploid)
10/24/02 01:55 PM
Re: Moonage Daydream new [re: goodbye_spaceboy]  

There's a comma between "man" and "love", isn't there? It's not "The Church of Man-Love" but "The Church of Man, love", which I always interpreted as sex-replaces-religion, with the man as a church for the woman (or other man, but not exclusively) or with "man" refering to mankind/ humanity. Theoretically any love song, as long as it doesn't say "he" and "she", could be about a same-sex couple, but I thought this thread wass about songs where homosexuality is explicitly the subject of the song.

---------------------------------------------------------------------

My life was saved by rock & roll.

abe11825
(electric tomato)
10/24/02 08:00 PM
Maybe...? new [re: Adam]  

Everyone has great points, but I was thinking maybe All The Young Dudes as well?

Now Jimmy looking sweet though he dresses like a queen
He can kick like a mule
It's a real mean team
We can love
Oh we can love

And my brother's back at home
With his Beatles and his Stones
We never got if off on that revolution stuff
What a drag
Too many snags
Well I drunk a lot of wine
And I'm feeling fine
Gonna race some cat to bed
Is this concrete all around
Or is it in my head
Oh brother you guessed
I'm a dude


I thought until "We can love" is part because it's as if they are saying they can love "Jimmy" for dressing like a queen. Maybe also "Gonna race some cat to bed" maybe gay too, because its not stated if its a male or female. It's in the same verse as Jimmy reference.

__________________________________________
Jimmy: I am Cry The Beloved!
Amy: No you're not. you're just washed up.
Jimmy: Supastar!
Amy: *mumbles under breath: "Snot"*

strangeDivine
(electric tomato)
10/24/02 09:07 PM
They came down hard on the faggots new [re: Adam]  

If indeed Bowie is/used to consider himself bisexual, I would assume that he would at least allude to it in his music. However, I have always found his lyrics to be more impressionistic rather than works that have an inflexible meaning.

Also, I agree with most of the choices for Bowie's most gay songs but if I wasn't specifically looking for the hidden gay meanings I probably wouldn't notice it. John I'm only dancing can be interpreted in a number of ways. In fact, I think this really adds to the song's mystery and mystique.

I seem to remember someone on this forum saying that they felt that "Scream Like A Baby" is a gay version of the Winston and Julia story. I pretty much agree.

By the way adam, I commend you for your ness!

They're not a real friend until they've stood over you while you throw up in a parking lot.


eraserhead
(cracked actor)
10/25/02 04:51 AM
Am I a psychic or what? new [re: eraserhead]  

In its first DAY, this thread got 17 replies (not counting Adam's own replies).

In its first WEEK, I'm Deranged - Kreutzberg, Berlin, 1977 (possibly the greatest Interpretation thread ever) got 11 replies.

Am I a psychic or what? :)



"Don't let Krusty's death get you down, boy. People die all the time, just like that. Why, you could wake up dead tomorrow. Well, good night!" Homer Simpson


Sysiyo
(acolyte)
10/25/02 05:00 AM
Re: Am I a psychic or what? new [re: eraserhead]  

You might be psychic, but you should not mistake quantity for quality (naturally no offense, Adam).



Starlite
(kook)
10/25/02 06:01 AM
Re: Am I a psychic or what? new [re: Sysiyo]  

I must be really stupid, but I still don't see the point of this thread. Isn't most everything on here simply stating the obvious?



ziggywombat
(cracked actor)
10/25/02 01:13 PM
not sure if you're a boy or a girl new [re: Starlite]  

In reply to:

though I want to add that I think "velvet goldmine" is quite a lovely metaphor in this case.



i think it's been said in previous threads that the term is slang for female bits, is that not correct? to me anyways it sounds like he's definately talking about a girl. but then it was used as a title for the movie so maybe i'm wrong.




you're like a one legged man in an ass kicking contest, you just can't win!

kingsteved
(kook)
10/25/02 03:27 PM
Re: not sure if you're a boy or a girl new [re: ziggywombat]  

I also thought of velvet goldmine-- as referring to "Female Bits" more than as a gay song. The "Bits" term is very cute by the way-- I'll remember to use that in my birds and bees lecture to my kids.



Starlite
(kook)
10/25/02 06:24 PM
Re: not sure if you're a boy or a girl new [re: kingsteved]  

La, well it is an equally lovely metaphor whether referring to yes, female bits, or a man's mouth. When I first heard the song, I couldn't tell which it was supposed to be (Bowie probably made it ambiguous on purpose), but after examination I've decided that a man's mouth is more probable. Firstly, because while the expression "giving head" can refer to both as well, "heal your head with my own" seems to be more male-oriented, and because the description from the singer's point of view seem to refer to actions also more often attributed to m/m sex ("suck you dry"), and secondly because 5years.com says the original title was "He's a Goldmine."

P.S. "You stroke me like the rain" while again, ambiguous, seems to me to describe the movements of a tongue better than the alternative.
Lol, should we get more detailed here?

Edited by Starlite on 10/25/02 06:25 PM (server time).



ziggywombat
(cracked actor)
10/26/02 02:04 PM
not just for boys anymore new [re: Starlite]  

In reply to:

female bits, or a man's mouth.



er, girls give head too, no matter what your girlfriend tells you

you're like a one legged man in an ass kicking contest, you just can't win!

Starlite
(kook)
10/26/02 03:43 PM
Re: not just for boys anymore new [re: ziggywombat]  

Of course they do! In fact, according to what my girlfriends tell, they'd be the only ones giving. :)

But considering a girl has both "female bits" and a mouth, I'd say if the song refers to a mouth, it's more probably that it's a guy's. Plus, again, "heal ya head with my own"--okay that seems explicitly gay to me.



ZiggyZane
(kook)
11/02/02 11:56 AM
Re: not just for boys anymore new [re: Starlite]  

In reply to:

I don't see anything explicitly "gay" about John, I'm Only Dancing. The most obvious interpretation would be that John is the boyfriend of Bowie's dancing partner, and that Bowie is reassuring John that even though "she turns me on" he's "only dancing". If the narrator of the song was supposed to be gay, why would this girl be turning him on so?


Exactly what I was going to say, twister.



"MAKING LOVE WITH HIS EGO!"

Sysiyo
(acolyte)
11/04/02 03:40 AM
Re: I don't see that Bowie really has many "gay" songs new [re: twister]  

In reply to:

If the narrator of the song was supposed to be gay, why would this girl be turning him on so?


He might be bisexual? Just as a point...



jennjenn
(mortal with potential)
11/05/02 06:12 PM
Re: Bowie's Gay Songs new [re: Adam]  

the only reading i've had into john i'm only dancing is the bisexual way. wouldn't it be kind of dangerous if they were both straight guys? a bloody fight would most definately have broken out.



ZiggyZane
(kook)
11/06/02 10:44 AM
Re: Bowie's Gay Songs new [re: jennjenn]  

Not really.. They could be best friends, or gentle men.

"MAKING LOVE WITH HIS EGO!"

Starlite
(kook)
11/06/02 01:50 PM
Re: Bowie's Gay Songs new [re: ZiggyZane]  

Well of course, if they were friends, then the only thing that'd happen would be a permanently damaged eye. :)



Satal
(absolute beginner )
11/12/02 04:22 PM
Re: Bowie's Gay Songs new [re: Starlite]  

Nice one....

Of course this is an excellent topic, and of course we're stating the obvious. However, think about all the poor, pitiful new Bowie fans who want to know? With that in mind, I'd like to make a distinction between:

Bowie's songs that CAN be interpreted as with a homosexual context

and

Bowie's songs that ARE written with a homosexual context

So...?

~Satal de Rihannsu~



Queen_Bitch_101
(grinning soul)
11/13/02 06:03 AM
Re: Bowie's Gay Songs new [re: Satal]  

I'd like to know, about "Scream like a baby", in what can it be interpreted in an homosexual way? some said it could, I don't agree at all. He's talking about this Sam guy whom he says to be "just like him", right, and then? I might be stupid but I don't see where is the sexual metaphore in this song.

I know that people think
That I'm a little crazy
Ohh, better sex is fun
I think I like fascination


Emil
(cracked actor)
11/13/02 09:54 AM
What's with this man-love new [re: SenselessThing]  

Hm, this man love thing? I was under the impression that "man-love" is a biblical (or just old) term for loving all fellow humans. In a non-sexual way. Now am I wrong about that??

On the other hand, in the context of the lyric of Moonage Daydream any love is more likely to be of sexual (or at least romantic) nature. So I don't know.

Then I'd like to promote She's got medals which is of course not homosexual at all, but still Bowie's first song about crossing gender boundaries. Pitt must have loved it.



Satal
(absolute beginner )
11/13/02 01:42 PM
Re: What's with this man-love new [re: Emil]  

I had always interpreted it in two different ways (I'm good at doublethink):

1. "...Church of Man, love..."

and

2. "...Church of Manlove..."

For the first, I tend to take it in the idea of, "Okay, Ziggy's an alien. This is the new church, he is the new priest, etc etc."

For the second, that's just my own dirty little brain that gets a kick out of all innuendos and oddities. If taken as case #2, it makes a great opening quote for naughty slash-fics.

~Satal de Rihannsu~

"I used to be into S&M, necrophelia, and bestiality, but I realised that was just beating a dead horse." -- Uknown

theodora75
(absolute beginner )
11/15/02 09:26 AM
Re: Bowie's Gay Songs new [re: Adam]  

Would I be mistaking if I would call "Sweet thing" from Diamond Dogs a gay song too?



bowiefanpeter
(acolyte)
11/15/02 01:48 PM
Re: What's with this man-love new [re: Satal]  

Cracked Actor

"...Suck baby, suck. Give me some head..."

"...show me your rear..."

Could both of these tow lines be construed as gay lines?

BFP



twister
(acolyte)
11/15/02 02:14 PM
Silly Starlite new [re: bowiefanpeter]  

In reply to:

[Sysiyo] [The narrator of John, I'm Only Dancing] might be bisexual? Just as a point...


Sure, of course. But to refer to a bisexual as "gay" is just as incorrect (and some might say insulting) as to say "straight". Hence even if the interpretation that Bowie and John are lovers is correct, it's no more a "gay" song than it would be a "straight" song.

In reply to:

[bfp] "...show me your rear..."


Methinks you'll find the line is "show me you're real" (or "show me your reel", as some have suggested).

I could be a genius if I just put my mind to it.

Satal
(mortal with potential)
11/15/02 04:12 PM
Re: Silly Starlite new [re: twister]  

About JIOD...

Some have suggested that "John" is Lindsay Kemp and the she in question is Angie.

Just something I've picked up along the way. I don't know if I float with it, but thought I'd pass it on without thinking about it.

Jeezy Chreesy, but I'm lazy.

~Satal de Rihannsu~

"God thinks he's all that and a bag of chips." -- David Bowie

"I used to be into S&M, necrophelia, and bestiality, but I realised that was just beating a dead horse." -- Uknown

SugarPlumFairy
(stardust savant)
11/17/02 05:53 PM
Re: not just for boys anymore new [re: Starlite]  

In reply to:

heal ya head with my own


I always thought it was "til your head is my home".
I may be wrong, but then again, some lyrics in the TW lyric section are pretty messed up.

hold me hold me hold me hold me hold me
please don't let me get away


bowiefanpeter
(acolyte)
11/17/02 09:31 PM
Re: not just for boys anymore new [re: SugarPlumFairy]  

In some circles being gay could be thought of as
"Modern Love". what this has to do with the 1983 song I have no idea. The lime green suit might be giveaway.

BFP



theodora75
(mortal with potential)
11/18/02 04:03 AM
Re: Bowie's Gay Songs new [re: Adam]  

Ok, My previous post has been
ignored ,but I really would like to discuss it.
To me "Sweet thing" from Diamond Dogs, seems a
gay song. It has not been mentioned by anyone,
so I think I am the only one.Am I?




AdamModerator
(crash course raver)
11/18/02 04:21 AM
Sweet Thing new [re: theodora75]  

I posted a lyric from "Sweet Thing" early in this thread. It is the chorus "if you want it boys, get it here" which I think is one of his least ambiguous gay lyrics.

Essentially, I think it is the ambiguity that has produced the differing opinions in this thread. It has been interesting hearing people's views.

get bowie downunder

AdamModerator
(crash course raver)
11/18/02 04:34 AM
It was always 1982 new [re: bowiefanpeter]  

In reply to:

In some circles being gay could be thought of as
"Modern Love". what this has to do with the 1983 song I have no idea. The lime green suit might be giveaway.


The lime green suit and the bleech blonde hair probably reflects then current fashions, rather than a recognised gay statement. The consensus seems to be that Bowie was producing a stark heterosexual image circa 1983. Interestingly, this seemed to upset Angela Bowie who considered his early bisexual statements, etc. as something of a greater cause.

If Bowie's first gay song was say "Over The Wall We Go" what was his last? With the exception of the songs from Outside, has there been any post 1980 song that could be considered even gender bending?

get bowie downunder

Dandelion
(mortal with potential)
11/21/02 11:40 AM
Re: Bowie's Gay Songs new [re: Adam]  

lady grinning soul is a gay song everybody knows that i think...

it's now or never...

th0mas
(cracked actor)
11/21/02 01:21 PM
Re: It was always 1982 new [re: Adam]  

In reply to:

The lime green suit and the bleech blonde hair probably reflects then current fashions, rather than a recognised gay statement.


you mean - at those time all people had that bad taste even those not gay? oh my good, the 80ies were worse than i'd ever expected...

life on a hill
where you drop your orange
on the way to your car
then travel a block
and a half to retrieve it
(c. cosper)


gnomad
(mortal with potential)
11/22/02 09:07 AM
Re: is this not homosexual?! new [re: Emil]  

"She got very tired of picking up girls"



twister
(acolyte)
11/23/02 10:41 AM
From homosexuality to soul music new [re: Adam]  

You don't think "it" is an ambiguous word, Adam?

As for when his last "gay" song came, I'd say they dried up with Diamond Dogs. The only song since then that could vaguely be considered is Boys Keep Swinging with "other boys check you out" but that strikes me more as a knowing wink towards knowing it sounds naughty without being so - to consider it a 'gay' song would be like considering Dylan's '66 lyric "everybody must get stoned" to be a 'drugs' lyric.

Nothing on 1. Outside registers for me either. It's epitomised by Spaceboy's "do you like girls or boys?", and it's more self-referential "remember me? it's Ziggy!" than actually carrying either substance or subtext.

I could be a genius if I just put my mind to it.

theodora75
(mortal with potential)
11/25/02 08:32 AM
Re: Bowie's Gay Songs new [re: Adam]  

I am pasting this from www.5years.com. It's a snippet from the Rolling Stone magazine Aladdin Sane review

" 'Let's Spend The Night Together' continues The Stones preoccupation. Here, one of the most ostensibly heterosexual calls in rock is made into a bi-anthem: The cover version is a means to an ultimate revisionism. The rendition here is campy, butch, brittle and unsatisfying. Bowie is asking us to re-perceive 'Let's Spend The Night Together' as a gay song, possibly from its inception. Sexual ambiguity in rock has existed long before any audience was attuned to it. However, though Bowie's point is well taken, his methods are not."
Ben Gerson (19 July 1973)

I never thought of this cover as a gay song until I read this review and I can't say I was convinced even after reading it.Should the
"They said we were too young
Our kind of love was no fun
But our love comes from above
Do it!
Let's make love" be interpreted as Bowie's gay accretion in this song? (I don't believe these lyrics recited by Bowie were in the original Stones song,were they?)

What are your thoughts?






xun_zi
(mortal with potential)
11/25/02 11:06 AM
Re: Bowie's Gay Songs new [re: Adam]  

I believe bowie sings gay songs for he is happy in his soul.



LaughingGnoome
(mortal with potential)
11/30/02 11:04 AM
Re: Bowie's Gay Songs new [re: xun_zi]  

The Secret Life Of Arabia

Im probably wrong about this song, but here goes.

Consider the line
"I walk through a desert song when the heroine dies"

also consider that a non-specific reference to the film Lawrence Of Arabia exists in the song
"You must see the movie the sand in my eyes"
Lawrence Of Arabia himself was gay.

Finally there is the following

"The secret life of Arabia
Never here never seen
Secret life ever green"

What secret life? why must the behaviour be kept secret?

There are very few lyrics in this song, so i cannot know for sure.




AdamModerator
(crash course raver)
05/12/03 08:34 AM
it new [re: twister]  

In reply to:

You don't think "it" is an ambiguous word, Adam?


The context of the sentence is important. The phrase "do you want it?" was, for some time, a popular reference to sex. For example, there's a scene in the movie Highlander where Wallace's wife says "do you want it"? and there's little doubt what she means. But yes, it's not without ambiguity.

In reply to:

Nothing on 1. Outside registers for me either. It's epitomised by Spaceboy's "do you like girls or boys?", and it's more self-referential "remember me? it's Ziggy!" than actually carrying either substance or subtext.


Which also raises the issue of character parts in Outside. When Bowie sings "I feel female", well, that's probably because he's singing Ramona's lines.


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dar
(absolute beginner )
05/23/03 12:39 PM
Re: clarification new [re: bowiefanpeter]  

You know I get tired of bowie doing gay content songs. Don't get me wrong I don't hate people if they are that way. Its just he has kind of worn out the subject if you ask me. I enjoy the songs that feature some of the subject for the music sake. Its just doesn't always go well with everyone. Here lately he has kind of dropped it until that song Hello Spaceboy. Its intresting but I think he was more infatuated with it then anything else.



dar
(mortal with potential)
05/23/03 12:45 PM
Re: sell, sell, sell new [re: Adam]  

Boys Keep Swinging I feel was a protest song against the allegations that the Movie Saturday Night Fever said about him. It was said he swings both ways men and boys. As far as the lyric Other boys check you out , I took that as a teenager we seem to compete with each other egos. I didn't take that as homosexual at all. If it wasn't for that video I wouldn't have ever thought anything of it. Again I feel he did the video just to mess with people because he just didn't give a shit what people thought so he did to f*ck with them.



dar
(mortal with potential)
05/23/03 12:52 PM
Re: Sweet Thing new [re: Adam]  

Hell that could mean he is posing as a pimp. why is everyone so anxious to make something out of nothing. this is my reply on Sweet thing where he sings "If you want it boys get it here then"

Edited by dar on 05/23/03 02:24 PM (server time).



dar
(mortal with potential)
05/23/03 12:57 PM
Re: clarification new [re: SenselessThing]  

It my opinion he is saying he needs the room and you got to party somewhere else so he can take the babe in for servicing.This is in reference to Suffergrette City when he says henry I can't take you this time.

Edited by dar on 05/23/03 02:25 PM (server time).



dar
(mortal with potential)
05/23/03 01:00 PM
Re: I could be king, you would be queen. new [re: Strawman]  

Thats really reaching unless you want to use it for your imagination.



dar
(mortal with potential)
05/23/03 01:06 PM
Re: I don't see that Bowie really has many "gay" songs new [re: twister]  

Again I have to disagree that "rebel rebel" isn't a gay song. The lyrics your face is a mess means your unkept but he still loves her. Are you a boy or a girl simply means the times where kids could be mistaken because of their appearance. You've torn your dress he's simply saying a mistaken identity.. remember than too people worn their hair longer . sorry for the spelling.



orcajenn
(electric tomato)
05/23/03 01:38 PM
Re: I don't see that Bowie really has many "g new [re: dar]  

but did many guys wear dresses back then? if she's wearing a dress and had long hair, it's seems a little hard to mistake her for a boy. that's how i interperet the song. but prove me wrong by all means, if i'm wrong about guys wearing dresses then, let me know!

We're the first of the British bands today. We've come to show you how it's done. Here's another song to fill your barren lives, it's called 'Fake Plastic Trees'.

smoker
(grinning soul)
05/23/03 01:56 PM
Re: I don't see that Bowie really has many "g new [re: orcajenn]  

what about the obvious- Oh,you pretty things and the pretty things are going to hell,criminal world just a couple that jumped out at me.



dar
(mortal with potential)
05/23/03 02:14 PM
Re: Bowie's Gay Songs new [re: Dandelion]  

what makes you think that?



dar
(mortal with potential)
05/23/03 02:16 PM
Re: Bowie's Gay Songs new [re: theodora75]  

I think he likes to play with peoples' heads



Strawman
(cracked actor)
05/23/03 02:25 PM
Re: Bowie's Gay Songs new [re: dar]  


In reply to:

I think he likes to play with peoples' heads.



Oh and fuck me backwards, aren't you living proof.



dar
(mortal with potential)
05/23/03 02:32 PM
Re: Bowie's Gay Songs new [re: Strawman]  

Don't cry its just my opinion. If you feel that way then I respect your opinion. He's just an entertainer. Not God.



dar
(mortal with potential)
05/23/03 02:42 PM
Re: I don't see that Bowie really has many "g new [re: orcajenn]  

The song goes you've torn your dress and looks like I've been there too. Well to me it just goes back that he has been mistaken by his appearance not necessarily that he was wearing a dress. Now on the cover of "The Man who sold the World" he's wearing one I know and theirs no doubt that the song "Width of a circle" is a homosexual song. As far as real sexual preferance only he knows. However I think Bowie is an exibhisits (again I am going to have to buy a dictionary) but yes he did some homosexual sex when he was young. Angie said that most things he did was have threesomes' with her and another girl. As long as he performs well who the hell is watching what he does with his slong.



het
(grinning soul)
05/23/03 04:24 PM
Re: I don't see that Bowie really has many "g new [re: orcajenn]  

In reply to:

but did many guys wear dresses back then?


Bowie did wear that "man-dress" in the very early seventies and had long hair, remember? Angie urged him to wear it. It may not have been a popular thing but obviously some people dressed like that.



SugarPlumFairy
(acolyte)
05/23/03 06:00 PM
Re: I don't see that Bowie really has many "g new [re: dar]  

In reply to:

As long as he performs well who the hell is watching what he does with his slong.


I think this thread wasn't about that, it's about analyzing Bowie's songs in a homosexual context.
Also, your million oneliner replies in a row give me an epileptic fit.

Access // Amnesia // Interface

dar
(mortal with potential)
05/23/03 07:27 PM
Re: I don't see that Bowie really has many "g new [re: SugarPlumFairy]  

I'm new and I got to get the hang of this thing. sorry thanks for the laugh though.



JoeTheLion84
(grinning soul)
05/23/03 11:00 PM
Re: clarification new [re: Starlite]  

I think that is a very interesting interpretation of Changes and it sounds very convincing to me. I still don't know about Lady Stardust, though it is somewhat gay by nature as it was in large part about Marc Bolan, who was very ambiguous himself.



Lexx
(absolute beginner )
05/24/03 07:56 AM
Re: sell, sell, sell new [re: dar]  

i agree, i never thought, "boys keep swinging" is a gay song.
it is rather a bit self-ironic: bowie, who used to wear dresses and make-up and anounced himself publicly bisexual, now tells us
"when you're a boy, you can wear a uniform,
other boys check you out - (don*t think that's meant sexually)
you get a girl
these are your favorite things
when you're a boy"
isn't it just supposed to be funny? that's at least how the song (not only the lyrics) sound to me



Frank_Solo
(wild eyed peoploid)
05/24/03 09:01 AM
Re: I don't see that Bowie really has many "gay" songs new [re: dar]  

In reply to:

Are you a boy or a girl simply means the times where kids could be mistaken because of their appearance.


I've always looked at this as a reference to 1984 (the book). The girl in the book fits the description very much, since she's not allowed to wear make-up or feminine clothes.

We'll watch nothing at all dance around.

thinwhiteme
(mortal with potential)
02/18/04 03:18 PM
Re: clarification new [re: Starlite]  

velvet goldmine isn't that a song by the velvet undergorund



SugarPlumFairy
(acolyte)
02/18/04 03:53 PM
Re: clarification new [re: thinwhiteme]  

Are you intentionally being a retard?

Actually, I'm a lab mouse on stilts.

hangontoyourself
(grinning soul)
02/21/04 05:05 PM
Re: Bowie's Gay Songs new [re: Adam]  

John I'm Only Dancing HAS to be, boys keep swinging suggests it too, the width of a circle is OBVIOUS.

If you think we're gonna make it...
http://groups.msn.com/keithism

The_Omen
(grinning soul)
02/25/04 05:00 PM
Re: Bowie's Gay Songs new [re: Adam]  

I think it's fairly obvious that if you are gay, then you will find more lyrics that include what YOU would call, gay overtones. If you're straight, you won't see nearly as many, and in fact, will interpret them as straight. When i'm listening to Bowie, i am not thinking to myself, 'that may be gay'.

I cannot live, I cannot die

hangontoyourself
(wild eyed peoploid)
02/28/04 10:05 AM
Re: clarification new [re: thinwhiteme]  

velvet goldmine can't be gay can it? it's very sexual, but i reckon aimed at a woman.

If you think we're gonna make it...
http://groups.msn.com/keithism

Grey_Nihilist
(kook)
02/28/04 07:15 PM
Re: clarification new [re: hangontoyourself]  

On the contrary, Velvet Goldmine sounds extremely gay to me. "Suck you dry"? C'mon.

I'm a DUMBASS!

The_Omen
(wild eyed peoploid)
03/07/04 07:57 PM
Re: clarification new [re: Grey_Nihilist]  

You can, in fact, suck a women dry, belive it or not, I heard somewhere....

I cannot live, I cannot die

Grey_Nihilist
(electric tomato)
03/07/04 10:17 PM
Re: clarification new [re: The_Omen]  

Well I think, generally speaking, giving head to a guy is referred to as "sucking" or "blowing" as the case may be, and giving head to a woman is more commonly referred to as "eating out" or "licking carpet" for the more vulgar types.

Anyways, look at it however you want. That's the beauty of interpretation.

This signature is subject to change without warning.

AngelicWhore
(mortal with potential)
03/21/04 03:07 PM
Re: sell, sell, sell new [re: CoolCanasta]  

I first thought that The Bewley Brothers was gay, but I've read that The Bewley Brothers is about Bowie's brother Terry who was schizophrenic. I think the line "I was stone and he was wax/so he could scream and still relax...unbelievable" is about the fact that Bowie was the one that couldn't show any emotions and had to be the strong one for Terry. Terry was wax because he changed so much because of his illness. Maybe I'm looking too much into this song, but it's great. I don't think people realize how deep that song is if they see it as a song about his brother.



AngelicWhore
(mortal with potential)
03/21/04 03:11 PM
Re: clarification new [re: Starlite]  

I read somewhere that Lady Stardust was about Marc Bolan. David saw one of his shows and apparently had a crush on him. To emphasize the fact that it was about Marc, David would have his picture projected on the wall when he would sing it in concert. I always thought that song was great because it really did remind me of Marc. Gotta love Marc!



TheYoungDude
(wild eyed peoploid)
03/21/04 04:53 PM
Re: clarification new [re: AngelicWhore]  

Yeah, the song was originally for Marc Bolan. You can find that version on the CD The Forgotten Songs of David Bowie.

The sisters fell back and said "Don't that man look pretty!"

AngelicWhore
(mortal with potential)
03/23/04 11:49 PM
Re: Bowie's Gay Songs new [re: Adam]  

I never really thought of John, I'm Only Dancing or Changes as being gay songs. I always thought that John, I'm Only Dancing was David talking to a guy named John about how he's confused as to why only dancing with the girl turns him on so much. Changes seems to be David telling the world about his plans about his rock career. He's looking into the "stream of warm impermanance" and wanting to change his situation. He's warning the older generation about his new brand of rock that will change so many people. He knows that he will have a following of some sort and is kind of predicting that. It's like he's saying "watch out, here I come and you can't stop me and the sexual and musical revolution that I will help in starting."



TheYoungDude
(wild eyed peoploid)
03/23/04 11:56 PM
Re: Bowie's Gay Songs new [re: AngelicWhore]  

Yeah, that's always what I thought Changes was about too. I've never thought that it could be considered a "gay song."

The sisters fell back and said "Don't that man look pretty!"


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