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BowieTalk
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AdamAdministrator
(acolyte)
03/20/04 01:48 AM
Re: LOW: Most Experimental Popular Album of the 20 [re: NoControl]  

....since you edited your post, thanks very much. Of course, when you start asking why Low (or most of Bowie's albums) don't go Gold in America, well I could say anything really. Perhaps they hate faggots over there?

But in more seriousness, I am doubting whether Zappa's (mass?) audience would have been as perplexed as Bowie's when he released Low. As far as I understand, Zappa evolved out of psychadelic rock where boundaries were already wider and where there was an audience of stoners ready to lap it up.

So No Control as the Zappa fan among us, I ask you to state the album that literally shocked Zappa's audience to the extent of Low but was as equally popular? Don't fucking tell me to check out his entire catalogue and get back to you in two years. White Prism earlier stated - Were Only In It for the Money - but that apparantly stalled at US #30 and UK #32. Next example please!




Bowie in Australia 2004 | Join the Community

NoControl
(kook)
03/20/04 02:21 AM
Re: LOW: Most Experimental Popular Album of the 20 new [re: Adam]  

"....since you edited your post, thanks very much. Of course, when you start asking why Low (or most of Bowie's albums) don't go Gold in America, well I could say anything really. Perhaps they hate faggots over there?"

Or perhaps it wasn't that popular in the first place and this thread is absurd and pointless?

"But in more seriousness, I am doubting whether Zappa's (mass?) audience would have been as perplexed as Bowie's when he released Low. As far as I understand, Zappa evolved out of psychadelic rock where boundaries were already wider and where there was an audience of stoners ready to lap it up. "

Frank didn't have anything to do with "Psychadelia" at all. He was from the "Freak" scene in Los Angeles, not from "Flower Power" land up north in San Fran. His audience was immensely diverse. But I wouldn't call his audience exclusively "stoners". Some did do drugs, unfortunately. Frank didn't. And Zappa's audiences were continuously perplexed with each and every album he released. He went from the satirical/iconoclastic parodied stylings on Freak Out, Absolutely Free & We're Only In It For The Money, to the jazz-fusion excursions of Hot Rats, through the big band fusion dabblings of The Grand Wazoo & Waka Jawaka and so forth and so on. How could anyone not be perplexed with this selection?

"So No Control, I ask you to state the album that literally shocked Zappa's audience to the extent of Low but was as equally popular?"

Well, that's really easy, considering Low wasn't that popular, as it only did around 350,000 in the US.

Sheik Yerbouti
Roxy & Elswhere
Apostrophe (')
Over-Nite Sensation
One Size Fits All
Zoot Allures
Ship Arriving Too Late To Save A Drowning Witch
We're Only In It For The Money
Joe's Garage Act I
Joe's Garage Acts II & III
Shut Up & Play 'Yer Guitar
Shut Up & Play 'Yer Guitar Some More
Return of the Son Of Shut Up & Play 'Yer Guitar
Hot Rats


The above are just some of Zappa's records that come to mind that equaled, if not surpassed Low's popularity and perplexed Zappa's following.

"Don't fucking tell me to check out his entire catalogue and get back to you in two years. White Prism earlier stated - Were Only In It for the Money - but that apparantly stalled at US #30 and UK #32. Next example please!"

Why not, Adam? You'd have yourself a complete musical education with Frank's music.

And I guess you're not aware of the fact that peak chart positions do not necessarily dictate the greatest sales of an album or single. So, We're Only In It For The Money, qualifies.

...don't tell god your plans...

Edited by NoControl on 03/20/04 02:24 AM (server time).



AdamAdministrator
(acolyte)
03/20/04 02:37 AM
Re: LOW: Most Experimental Popular Album of the 20 new [re: NoControl]  

A better post this time, but once again, you're obsessing terribly over US sales. Granted, Bowie was getting better US sales in 74-77 compared to other times of his career but we also know that the US usually means jack shit to Bowie. It is further exemplified when we start comparing him (a UK artist) to a US one. That whole problem comes up time and again with us, No Control. 130 million sales worldwide, remember?

Assuming Zappa WAS Bowie's creative and popular equivalent......how was their relationship with each other? I heard there was friction.



Bowie in Australia 2004 | Join the Community

Earthling on Fire
(electric tomato)
03/20/04 03:00 AM
Re: LOW: Most Experimental Popular Album of the 20 new [re: Adam]  

I don't know about Bowie and Zappa but rumour has it that Zappa tried to lobby Verve out of signing The Velvet Underground. Does anyone know if that's true?

Wear your wound with honour.

NoControl
(kook)
03/20/04 03:04 AM
Re: LOW: Most Experimental Popular Album of the 20 new [re: Adam]  

"A better post this time, but once again, you're obsessing terribly over US sales."

You were the one who implied that his Scandinavian sales weren't important and that they were hence, "negligible". So naturally I was showing you examples of other stats.

" That whole problem comes up time and again with us, No Control. 130 million sales worldwide, remember?"

And you know why it's a problem? Because Bowie hasn't sold anywhere near 130 million albums. He might of sold 130 million singles and albums though.

"Assuming Zappa WAS Bowie's creative and popular equivalent......how was their relationship with each other? I heard there was friction."

Uh Adam, Frank Zappa was so far above and beyond Bowie in terms of just about everything that it's laughable to even think Bowie could surpass him with anything other than record sales (which Bowie has), that I would easily say Bowie wasn't anywhere near Zappa's creative equivalent - no one was or is! FZ has nearly 80 albums of material released to date. And to add to that, there's 70-80 albums worth of material that hasn't even been released yet!

As far as their relationship goes. There really wasn't one. On FZ's '78 European tour in Berlin (I think), Bowie wandered up to the front of the stage during one of Zappa's solos and asked Adrian Belew to join his band! He obviously accepted and weeks later he was on tour with David! Frank wasn't amused with this as it was evident when Bowie and Zappa's Band were in the same restaurant after the show. Bowie approached Frank and tried to mutter something but before he could, Zappa said, "Go away Major Tom"! He really didn't want anything to do with him at the time. But Frank eventually gave Belew his blessing to go and play with Bowie in the end. Zappa even parodied Let's Dance in a song called Be In My Video.

Here's the lyrics:

Be in my video,
Darling, every night
I will rent a cage for you
And mi j-i-nits dressed in white
(teeny-little-tiny-little . . . )

Twirl around in a lap dissolve
Pretend to sing the words
I'll rent a gleaming limousine;
Release a flock of
Ber-herna-herna-herna
Herna-her-nerds

Wear a leather collar
(Wear a leather collar)
And a dagger in your ear
I will make your nose smell the glove
And try to look sincere, then we'll

Dance the blues
(Oh yes)
Let's dance the blues
(We'll dance the blues)
Let's dance the blues
(We'll dance them very much)
Under the megawatt moonlight

Pretend to be Chinese,
(One-hung-low)
I'll make you wear red shoes
There's a cheesy atom bomb explosion
All the big groups use

Atomic light will shine
(Will shine)
Through an old venetian blind
(Venetian blind)
Making patterns on your face,
(On your face)
Then it cuts to outer space

With its billions & billions &
Billions & billions

Be in my video
(In my video)
Darling, every night
(Darling, every night)
Everyone in cable-land
(Everyone in cable-gable-land)
Will say you're 'outa-site'
(I say they'll say you're 'outa-site')

You can show your legs
(You can show the pretty legs)
While you're getting in the car, then
(In my red hot bright car, then I . . . )
I will look repulsive
([With my big ears and all])
While I mangle my guitar

Reen-toon-teen-toon-teen-toon
Tee-nu-nee-nu-nee,
Moo-ahhhh

Reen-toon-teen-toon-teen-toon
Tee-nu-nee-nu-nee,
Moo-ahhhh

Reen-toon-teen-toon-teen-toon
Tee-nu-nee-nu-nee,
Moo-ahhhh

Tee-nu-nee----moo-ahhhh
Tee-nu-nee----moo-wah-wah-wah-ooo

After all the close-up shots
Of you in bondage leather
They'll spray an alley with a hose
And we'll escape together, while we

Dance de blude agin
(I'm dancing the blues)
(Oh yes, we'll dance the blues)
Led dance de blude agin
(I'm dancing the blues)
(Sure we will)
Led dance de blude agin
(I'm dancing . . . )
(We'll dance them blues)
In de middle o' de alley

Let's dance your face
(Let's dance your face)
Let's dance your lips
(And dance your lips)
Let's dance your nose
(We can dance your nose)
And then we'll dance your sinus
MOO-AHHHH!




...don't tell god your plans...

Edited by NoControl on 03/20/04 03:09 AM (server time).



bowiefanpeter
(acolyte)
03/20/04 06:16 AM
Re: LOW: Most Experimental Popular Album of the 20thC? new [re: Adam]  

I can only keep on thinking one thing during this entire thread.

Why is the LOW album never mentioned outside the Bowie legend?

People here call it the greatest album of the 20th century. Looking at it closer, outside David articles, and being namechecked a couple time by Trent, I don't think I have ever seen it once mentioned as being an independantly strong piece of music. It's not even considered amongst Eno's creme de la creme of albums he's worked on.

Maybe people still have to come around to the album, or they never think Bowie could be a serious composer.

I, personally, love this album. Just what am I missing?

BFP



th0mas
(acolyte)
03/20/04 07:41 AM
Re: LOW: Most Experimental Popular Album of the 20 [re: NoControl]  

hell - this is fucking funny... i did not listen much to zappa so far, but what i heard i liked. i think he tried a lot - probably way more than bowie - but his "mainstream" part (which is probably what i heard) never sounds like being a serious attempt of creating something new but rather like trying around and playing. Zappa and Bowie seem to have two completly different approaches. did zappa ever sink together with his ship like bowie did? he seemed to be beyond those common definitions of success - at least i think he had much less impact than a ziggy stardust - and more respectless towards everything, which probably resulted in people seeing him much more as a weirdo, who was allowed to do a lot without getting harmed by the result, while bowie, who had a mainstream name, fall flat on his face with every wrong step.

did this show my opinion towards the headlining question?! perhaps i don't have an opinion at all on this topic...

"Have you tried... not being a mutant?"

SysiyoModerator
(thunder ocean)
03/20/04 02:34 PM
Re: LOW: Most Experimental Popular Album of the 20 [re: th0mas]  

My only opinion thus far is that I was fool to forget that NoControl can't be wrong.

KArt | Project Michelangelo | LiveJournal

Marquis
(acolyte)
03/20/04 02:45 PM
The Problem With Zappa [re: NoControl]  

Is that Comedy Rock gets old in about ten minutes. Yes, I realized he was on a bit of a different plane from Moldy Peaches, but still, I can usually only laugh at goofy song lyrics once or twice, and after that, I get bored. Unless, of course, its MC Paul Barman.

As for this question, I'd have to go White Album.

Where's my little trouble girl?
There's no real trouble girl
Where's my little trouble girl?
C'mon c'mon c'mon


pablopicasso
(electric tomato)
03/20/04 04:42 PM
Re: LOW: Most Experimental Popular Album of the 20 [re: Sysiyo]  

I have missed NOcontrol, he is always so serious and RIGHT!!!

with a good head for facts and figures, which he always used to prove his point

I believe in the Power of Good
I Believe in the State of Love
I Will Fight For the Right to be Right
I Will Kill for the Good of the Fight for the Right to be Right



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